Too advanced(?) = Pings like a mother, will run backwards kind of too advanced. 'Our production bike is the worlds fastest' [when it came out] so now you are going to try to get more timing and do what with the [stock] parts?
TRE = If the gps sensor fails the tre kicks in. Say you're drag/road/hooligan racing and the sensor fails at over 150 mph. Will the tre retard @ 150+? Of course not. It could overheat the engine, score the piston skirts, snowball the aluminum off the skirt of the piston, begin to weld to the cylinder wall, lock the crank, and toss the rider off the bike. Would you design a bike like that with that kind of 'retard scenario?'
Ign = I'm going to apply a 1970's delco remy kind of black box made for a harley. There are 3 ignition curve stages: idle-low/mid load/heavy load. The sensor fails, the idle/low remains, the heavy load remains. Mid curve is lost. So watt you feel is the idle to heavy [seat of the pants] transition or a more abrupt curve going from 10° to 55°. The 40° is lost, according to the harley shop manual's limited abstract explaining the failure of the vacuum switch called a VOES (vacuum operated electrical switch).
I'm going to say the same thing happens with the FI type ignition of today. If the gps fails the same full advance remains, the same ilde/low curve remains. That's why it starts normal with the tre, as you heard no starting complaints.
Conclusion:
Mapping wise, the adjustable advance is out of phase with the cam sensor so you almost feel a tre twitch.
Mapping wise, you'll never mimic the tre = Digital signal is set, no longer are you in the analog of 1N23456.
Mapping wise, you'll have to run 10° up to mid, then full advance from mid to WOT.
Mapping wise, you play with retard with more exotic fuels and their burn rates.
Mapping wise, you might ping/det with too much advance if not run the engine backwards with the advance firing too soon. And when it reaches the kinetic (TDC), that pressured bubble will make it spin in reverse. Retard fires late and the unspent is not helped so much after TDC (no heat build via kinetic).
An interesting thing Ivan told me
I questioned everything Ivan said trying to figure out the tre's move... DTT/flipflop/analog/digital/AFR/etc... finally explained it away for me in so many words.
(Hub mentioned this a long time ago too)
The long time ago was to watch lift with the AFR meter. It's not even close to that 'cut fallacy.'
is that when you are decelling at 0% throttle, the fuel cut means there is NO fuel coming out of the injectors.
My 0% means the same thing as lift [the foot off the gas pedal]. So when I'd watch the AFR meter swing to 18a+, 18-22a is still fuel burning. There is no injector cutout. Think about it. If the cut was 0 fuel, why would you need spark sending in blanks. With that said, go switch the kill off and tell me if you smoothly coast or the air pump is now really slowing things down. If you think there is no fuel with this decel-cut, I more or less contradicted the cut theory.
Remember, I simply disconnected about 9 sensors, where some gave a seat of the pants change in mapping. And I can't remember which hack set the 16.5a on lift? So be it 18 or 16.5a, the sniffer measured an air to fuel ratio (AFR). So don't place me in Ivan's camp we start cutting the cuts.
The engine is NOT running--it's shut off the same as if you hit the kill switch.
Try it then. Hit the kill and listen to the engine note change.
Touch the throttle again and the fuel comes back on.
Think about it. You can't even feel the transition it's so fluid and/or linear; be it either up or down.
The engine starts up again.
Think about it. If you flipped the kill back on, you'd probably get a pop in the pipe. Like a light switch coming back on.
So all that cool decel noise is just engine vacuum. There is no ignition happening.
That decel pop is a lean running engine. The AFR (less fuel) moves up (18a) in air numbers on lift. The PAIR cut; moves the numbers down (less air) and the pop goes somewhat silent.
My only question about a TRE v adjusting by Ignition Module is, "is eliminating the timing retard better than advancing by ignition module 2~4 degrees?"
Again, the tre is flipping a map in flop. Flip is no code, flop is code set. So without knowing the cell numbers in the code map, you're guessing at it, might throw pings at it, might run it backwards, might overheat the bike. Have at it but I think you're wasting your time trying to make the bike even faster when it's all she wrote formula wise stock.
Tormenting the motorcycling community one post at a time